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Episode Summary:
01:27 – Does a life of no fun and no parties lead to better dating prospects? Find out in this episode!
04:15 – Discover the secret world of women’s hookup culture – do they keep a tally, and how detailed do they get?
05:47 – Surprised that women don’t hire dating coaches? Find out why and how it puts men at an advantage.
06:35 – Do men really never talk about their dates? Hear the truth from our guest!
08:16 – Every guy on Discord is encouraged to post about all the girls they’re interested in – find out why and what they gain from it.
11:23 – “He’s a great guy, but he’s a shitty texter” – is this a deal-breaker or just a minor hurdle? Our guest shares her take.
12:18 – Think only men ghost and breadcrumb? Think again – find out what women are doing these days!
13:08 – Don’t be fooled by stereotypes: anyone can benefit from a dating coach, and our guest has the proof.
14:14 – Online dating or social circle – which one works better? We compare and contrast.
15:37 – Avoid getting cucked – our guest shares her tips on how to navigate the dating scene.
16:52 – Are you a geek? Our guest’s story proves that you too can have dating success with a little patience and persistence.
In this revealing episode, we explore the world of dating with juicy insights from the IC Community Discord. From the secret world of women’s hookup culture to the support system that men find on Discord, we cover it all. Our guest shares her take on why women don’t hire dating coaches and how men and women approach dating differently. We also discuss the importance of good communication in relationships, online dating versus the social circle, and how to avoid getting cucked. Tune in for some eye-opening secrets about the dating world, and find out why everyone needs a dating coach!
Transcript
Mariia Kramer [00:00:00]:
When you’re drunk, you ready to have fun. Oh, maybe sex for one night. Oh, it’s fine. I was drunk. It’s okay.
Robbie Kramer [00:00:05]:
Hey, guys, we’re back for the Interconfidence Podcast.
Mariia Kramer [00:00:08]:
You can have fun and explore with your husband.
Robbie Kramer [00:00:11]:
Do your girlfriends count men that they hook up with?
Mariia Kramer [00:00:13]:
Oh, of course.
Robbie Kramer [00:00:14]:
How detailed do they get?
Mariia Kramer [00:00:16]:
Super detailed.
Robbie Kramer [00:00:17]:
I don’t think there’s many women hiring dating coaches. No one’s even going to ask, like, what position did you do? I got cuffed. Like, you lose a girl to another guy. Probably would have married the wrong girl. You’re 37. You’re like, oh, my God, I’m running out of time. I better find a wife. And you got time. Women are doing this, guys.
Speaker C [00:00:32]:
Welcome to the Interconfidence Podcast, where we bring you men’s dating and lifestyle advice that doesn’t suck. I’m your host, Robbie Kramer, a former collegiate golfer turned poker pro turned finance guy who became obsessed with learning about male female attraction and dynamics and passionate about teaching men how to improve and optimize their love life. Tune in each week and we’ll bring you the latest and greatest strategies on how to get more dates, how to build a thriving social circle that brings the best men and women into your life, how to become a better networker, and how to design a lifestyle that makes all your buddies jealous. If you’re new to the show, I recommend you download my first Date Protocol. It’s the best piece of content I have. It’ll help you optimize your first date and subsequent dates. And I like to connect with my listeners personally, so if you want to grab a copy of that, please send me a direct message on Instagram. I’m at Robbie Kramer. Now, let’s dive into this week’s content.
Robbie Kramer [00:01:22]:
Hey, guys, we’re back. I’m with my wife, Maria. And so you always wanted to get married? You never wanted to explore and have fun and party, or did you?
Mariia Kramer [00:01:34]:
You can have fun and explore with your husband. It doesn’t mean boring person.
Robbie Kramer [00:01:41]:
I don’t think you’re the rule. I think you’re the exception to the rule because I think especially in Western culture, and obviously you’re from Ukraine, which hasn’t been impacted as nearly as much by feminism in Western culture, but there’s such a huge draw as a young woman to get a good job. And I don’t need a man, and I want to not start a family until I’m in my late 20s or early thirty s and get a big body count. Not tell anybody I got a big body count, but maybe do those things, explore your sexuality and kind of just be young and crazy and free for a long time. I mean, that’s certainly what I wanted to do, which is what I did for almost 40 years. And a lot of your friends did want that experience, right?
Mariia Kramer [00:02:35]:
And they still haven’t.
Robbie Kramer [00:02:36]:
What was it, do you think, that made you want something different than that? Because there’s a lot of guys who are, like, looking for the one. Right? My hair looks retarded, by the way. I definitely need a haircut. Like a party parrot again. But what do you think is different versus you versus your friends that made you want to not do those things that I just mentioned?
Mariia Kramer [00:03:03]:
I don’t know. Just from childhood, I was always dreaming to get married till 27 and have children till 27. For some reason, I was studying. I never had time to I mean, I had time to go out, but because I don’t drink alcohol, it’s not so much fun for me. Everyone is drinking. Everyone is pushing me to drink, and it’s not so much fun for me. That’s why yeah, it was never interesting for me.
Robbie Kramer [00:03:35]:
I think that’s probably a huge part of it is not drinking. Not drinking.
Mariia Kramer [00:03:39]:
Because if I would drink when you’re drunk, you already will have fun. Oh, maybe sex from one night. Oh, it’s fine. I was drunk. It’s okay. It’s like my old girlfriend. I was drunk. I hook up with that guy. Yeah, it was lame. Or it was good. Anyway, I was drunk.
Robbie Kramer [00:03:54]:
So your girlfriends count? Like, the men that they hook up with in their count if they were drunk?
Mariia Kramer [00:04:01]:
Of course, if you were drunk, it can be an excuse. If it was some not so good.
Robbie Kramer [00:04:08]:
Guy, I feel like a lot of women, they just won’t even count. That be like, oh, I was drunk.
Mariia Kramer [00:04:14]:
It doesn’t count. No. Yeah, it doesn’t count. It’s an excuse to not count the person because she was drunk.
Robbie Kramer [00:04:21]:
Right.
Mariia Kramer [00:04:22]:
And for me, it was never an excuse.
Robbie Kramer [00:04:25]:
So when your friends talk about the guys that they hook up with, how detailed do they get?
Mariia Kramer [00:04:30]:
Super detailed. You discuss everything. Because what I like about your man’s group that you teach guys to discuss all the details about dates, what didn’t work out, what happened and everything. Because I think that the guys never discuss anything. It was like their bros and brothers, good friends. It’s never an option to discuss some insecurities and everything, but girls always discuss it. That it’s so much easier for us.
Robbie Kramer [00:05:01]:
It’s interesting, right? Like, girls will go into incredible detail.
Mariia Kramer [00:05:06]:
Like, about all insecurities. Like, oh, I had that problem, and I told that he didn’t like it. Maybe he didn’t want to fuck me because of that. And blah, blah, blah. And you will share it, and your girlfriend will say, oh, my God, in your mind, it’s so wrong. I don’t think he will notice that. And blah, blah, blah.
Robbie Kramer [00:05:23]:
So you guys are meticulously, going through each date, each guy talking about everything, talking about what worked, what didn’t work, maybe mistakes that you made, things that you were insecure about. Right?
Mariia Kramer [00:05:37]:
Yeah, it’s like two hour video call.
Robbie Kramer [00:05:39]:
Interesting. And you’re doing that with multiple girls, right?
Mariia Kramer [00:05:42]:
I mean, I have two best friends, but yeah, I can speak with good friends about this too.
Robbie Kramer [00:05:47]:
I don’t think there’s many women hiring dating coaches.
Mariia Kramer [00:05:51]:
No, because they don’t need they can call the best friend. Get some wine for me. Just juice. And discuss all the problems.
Robbie Kramer [00:05:58]:
Right.
Mariia Kramer [00:05:59]:
And after you, like after therapy.
Robbie Kramer [00:06:01]:
Exactly. You’re kind of getting free therapy from each other.
Mariia Kramer [00:06:04]:
Yeah.
Robbie Kramer [00:06:04]:
And if you’re a beautiful girl, you probably have beautiful girlfriends, and you’re probably not going to take the advice from a girlfriend who’s not so beautiful or who doesn’t have the experience a lot of the time. Is that right?
Mariia Kramer [00:06:15]:
It depends. You can never coach yourself. You never can be your own coach. A lot of people can give good advices, even if they’re not so good in that thing, I think. Yeah.
Robbie Kramer [00:06:27]:
What I find interesting is that guys don’t naturally do that. I never really talked to any of my guy friends about anything in detail about a date or anything dating related. It was just kind of like embarrassing. It’s like the entire conversation for most guys, it’s like, oh, yeah, that girl’s hot. Yeah, we started hooking up. How was it? Oh, it was good. Amazing body. What an ass. Right. No one’s even going to ask, what position did you do?
Mariia Kramer [00:06:57]:
Because even that, of course, this is so awkward.
Robbie Kramer [00:07:01]:
And then some guy will be like, oh yeah, you went on a date. Yeah, it was a good date.
Mariia Kramer [00:07:04]:
Yeah. Cool.
Robbie Kramer [00:07:04]:
What you guys do? Oh, I went to the movies. Nice, right? That’s how most of my conversations went.
Mariia Kramer [00:07:10]:
But most of the guys still lying because the percentage of them having success on those days is not so high.
Robbie Kramer [00:07:17]:
Exactly.
Mariia Kramer [00:07:18]:
But they will still say, oh, it was good. I really didn’t like her because her nails weren’t so beautiful to me. And that’s all you won’t actually share. I failed. I did something wrong. I didn’t know what happened. Can you help me? They will never say something like that.
Robbie Kramer [00:07:34]:
Yeah. And I think that’s one of the biggest things that changed for me is once I joined a community of men and we started telling each other about the nitty gritty. And obviously I listened to the guys who were quite a bit more advanced than I was versus the guys who I thought were below me. But that’s when I really started to improve my dating skills, my social skills, because we just actually started talking about what’s going on. And it’s shocking to me that this naturally happens for women, but it really doesn’t for men. Just I’ll give you guys a sneak peek real quick into our community, and I’ll just pull up one of the threads here. We’ve got all these channels under the IC community, right? But one of the most popular ones is called this Organized Girl Advice. So the one that we’re in right now and there’s guidelines to making posts, and you can see there’s all the posts here. Mandy 27 and met her at night game. Stephanie, 24, met her on Tinder. Jasmine, 27, met her on Day game. Cindy, 34, hookup app. Right? Some of these are seeking, some of these are Instagram DMs, some are bumble. And there’s posting guidelines. So what you have to do is the forum is for a girl you expect to have many interactions with and you want help with from us over a period of time. And it’s not intended for new leads. Those should go into like the lead generation, lead conversion channels. So you have to create a new thread for each girl that you want to help with. You make the title of the thread, her name plus her age, plus where you met her, and then use relevant tags for like day game, night game, online game, that sort of thing. So then the guys will post. Let’s take, I guess. How about Stephanie from Tinder? Right? You can see as a long set. So so George dates had zero made out, no sex, no. Met Stephanie on Tinder. I had to do some quick thinking, but fingers crossed. Actually meet her tonight. I need a win. And then he posts the screenshot here and then a follow up screenshot. And then we give him advice. My tentative plan for a three venue set up tonight. Hopefully my connect is working tonight will get me in. I’ll share those other two screenshots. So this is the first one. Here’s the second one. You guys want to read this? Just pause the video and read this, right? And then here’s the third one. And then we give advice on what to do. So Jonathan says, nice work, let us know how it went. FYI, not deciding on the venue and saying she should come over so you can figure it out is suboptimal. Be decisive, pick a venue one, tell her what it is, then pick her up in an Uber as Robbie suggested. Also, I think revealing that you have an adventure plan with a bunch of venues is not ideal and will scare some girls off. I would just tell them about venue one and then control the flow of the date and take it where you want, adjust accordingly. And then I respond in here. As you can see, this thread goes on and on and on and on and on. And the idea let me go back to the video here. Idea is we’re doing that all the time with like every guy is encouraged to post about all of the girls that they are interested in because why wouldn’t you? Women are already doing this about all of you guys. Of course they are prepared. They are going into that dating game with the cavalry. They’ve got their friends, they’ve got the plan, they’ve got a show of experience.
Mariia Kramer [00:11:15]:
You need to get even. Your sister, you notice, she shows us the guy, his picture, what do they think about him? Read his texting, blah, blah, blah, she asked for approval.
Robbie Kramer [00:11:24]:
She said something so funny the other day. She was like, I really like him, but he’s a shitty texter. So I’m having second thoughts. And I’m like, but you know him in person. You like him. You’ve been out with him. And she’s like, yeah, but he’s so bad over text. It makes me rethink my decision. And it’s a red flag. And I think that’s a it’s true because I think text reveals a lot. And what he was doing, he was saying boring stuff like Happy Sunday or Happy Monday, and just like, come on. He just wasn’t bringing any fun. And everyone’s going to appear fun in the beginning, but then as time goes on, people get a little bit lazy and their true colors come out. So if he’s that boring to begin with, guess how boring he’s going to be. A couple of years in a relationship, he’ll be more boring than I am. That’s pretty hard to do. But back to my point. Women are doing this, guys. Shake the screen like that. Women are doing this, guys. They are like going out and sharing all of these data points with their girlfriends. And they’ve got a strategy. And if you don’t have a strategy, you’re probably not going to succeed nearly as well as if you did.
Mariia Kramer [00:12:45]:
I agree. You need to have some support group of guys who helps you.
Robbie Kramer [00:12:51]:
Yeah. I mean, whether or not you choose to join the IC community or you’ve got some buddies that you’ve got like a WhatsApp message group with, or maybe you guys are on your own discord channel or whatever. If you’re not doing that well, you’re losing out to all the guys who are. Right? And in the past, it used to kind of be like a stigma. Like, oh, I don’t need a dating coach, or only weirdos or guys with no game would do that. But now what I’m seeing is that almost all of my clients, they don’t need me. They come to me because they’re already good. They want to be great, right? They want to get the upper echelon, the most beautiful women, and there’s other guys gunning for those girls. And if you’re not beating the competition, well, guess what? You’re not going to get those girls. So if there’s other guys willing to put the thought, the preparation, all of their mastermind friends behind their and resources behind their efforts, like, who’s going to win? Right?
Mariia Kramer [00:13:57]:
I agree. I think it’s obvious.
Robbie Kramer [00:14:01]:
Yeah. Gone are the times where you could just fall into a great relationship. It doesn’t really exist now. You got to navigate all the toxic all the toxic people out there. We could do a whole podcast. We probably should do a whole podcast.
Mariia Kramer [00:14:15]:
Especially online dating. At least you meet someone through social circle and you trust this person. This person also knows you from someone and she trusts you. It’s easier to get in a good relationship because you met through the social circle. But when you meet someone through tinder, a lot of girls just want to go to restaurants, have free food, or just go and have some fun. They will say to the guy, I want to go to that club. He will pay for her, and she’ll just have fun. And she’s just using it as a platform to get what she needs and she wants. And it’s never about the guy. Rarely about the guy if he’s super hot and she really wants to have sex with him.
Robbie Kramer [00:15:00]:
Yeah. I Mean, one of the biggest skills I think I developed was being able to tell which girls were once you’re good enough to attract women that you actually think are really beautiful, you Got to be able to weed out which ones are interested in a relationship versus which ones are probably just wanting to have fun and that you shouldn’t really emotionally invest in. And I think that’s really I had to learn a lot of hard lessons from that and go through a lot of really painful situations where girls just totally broke my heart. Or I had situations where I was just like, got totally, I don’t know, simped. Is that even a word? Cucked. Not like actually cucked no one was having sex with my wife or whatever that term really means, but I got cuck. You lose a girl to another guy, you could say. And that’s one of the biggest things, too, that we talk about in the group. It’s like we avoid those tragic scenarios where guys over invest in a girl that they really like and then end up in a world of pain. And during my progress, too, I had guys around me, and I was obviously in my own group and with other mentors. But had I not had that support system, probably would have married the wrong girl. Probably would have like.
Mariia Kramer [00:16:23]:
One kid from one divorce, another kid from another divorce.
Robbie Kramer [00:16:27]:
And so much child support to pay.
Mariia Kramer [00:16:30]:
No. It’s crazy what happens when you marry to the wrong person. It’s just like in three more months, you understand that you don’t like each other. Even not just love, you don’t like each other. And you’re already cheating on each other for last five months.
Robbie Kramer [00:16:46]:
And I needed a lot of time. I’m 40. We met when I was what, 38? Yeah, I just turned 38. We met literally right after my birthday.
Mariia Kramer [00:16:57]:
Twelve days after my birthday, right after my breakup.
Robbie Kramer [00:17:01]:
And your graduation, too. Yeah. And I’m a really immature 40 year old, and you’re an extremely mature 24 year old. And most of the time, I think you’re the more mature one in the relationship at this point. Also, given you’re from Ukraine and I’m from the US. You grow up faster in a culture. We grow up kind of more sheltered, depending on I’m a Jewish boy from a sheltered Jewish family. Shelter is the right word, but I was a geek growing up. My parents put me in private school until 8th grade, and then I went to San Diego. I didn’t even start partying until I was, like, 30. I mean, I partied before that, but I was never around any sort of drugs or people really partying until my early 30s. So most people growing up in Eastern Europe, they get, like, a dose of that when they’re like, 18, right?
Mariia Kramer [00:17:56]:
No, like 1515.
Robbie Kramer [00:17:58]:
Yeah. So, yeah, you guys, if you’re listening to this and you’re 37, you’re like, oh, my God, i, like, running out of time. I better find a wife. And you got time, man. Get your game straight. Join a community of other dudes who are beasts and learn from them.
Mariia Kramer [00:18:16]:
Or maybe you have a best friend mindset and you can share with him something and open up. Maybe he also has something to share with you and you will build even better relationship with him.
Robbie Kramer [00:18:27]:
Yeah. So the overall goal, overall point is make sure you’re talking about this stuff a lot and going over details a lot. Just like if you were a professional athlete, you’d look at your game footage and you’d go over it with a coach and you’d have trainers and you have people helping you. Because if you want to win in love, you got to be prepared.
Mariia Kramer [00:18:44]:
I agree.
Robbie Kramer [00:18:45]:
Thanks for coming on, baby.
Mariia Kramer [00:18:46]:
Yeah.
Robbie Kramer [00:18:48]:
And we’ll see you guys next time.
Mariia Kramer [00:18:51]:
Bye.
Speaker C [00:18:52]:
I hope you enjoyed this week’s episode. If you’re new to the show and digging our content, please leave us a five star review on itunes, Stitcher, YouTube, wherever you listen or watch. But if you’re not really digging it, go ahead. Just don’t leave us any review at all. That’d be great. If you’re feeling a little bit stuck or you just want to optimize and step up your game, we’ve opened up a few spots in our inner confidence community. We’re accepting applications. If you want to join our select group of men and experience the radical power of accountability, cross everything off your sexual bucket list and just become a beast who gets more stuff done. To learn more and apply, go to start innerconfidence.com.
